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Author Topic: Lacking quality in Sony vegas  (Read 7343 times)

Offline DanceVideoTV

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Lacking quality in Sony vegas
« on: February 07, 2013, 09:39:17 PM »
Hoping I posted in the proper spot, apparently I dont know as much as I thought I do, but I use sony vegas pro 11, upon rendering my video as main concept AVC/ACC (Mp4.) in internet HD 1080p it seems to lack some serious quality, I used a custom template in hopes of tweaking it for high quality but to no avail, I've see film on the net with movie like quality using the T2i on youtube with no editing just stock footage, any help?

~Thanks
« Last Edit: February 07, 2013, 09:54:01 PM by DanceVideoTV »

Offline AndyCivil

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Re: Lacking quality in Sony vegas
« Reply #1 on: February 07, 2013, 11:13:54 PM »
It's too late at night to try this out before posting, but here's an idea: what are your project settings set to? I mean, if your project is set to VHS quality (I'm being figurative) but when you press the "render" button you choose Hi-Def, I think you'll still only get VHS quality - albeit in an Hi-Def 'container' - LOL.

It's also possible that a quirk of your input/output format choices is causing a bad conversion, e. g. frame rate, interlacing.

I'm on Vegas 10, but I get good results.

I'm really tied up busy tomorrow, but in time, I think I can help with this.

Offline DanceVideoTV

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Re: Lacking quality in Sony vegas
« Reply #2 on: February 08, 2013, 11:58:53 AM »
Well if you can help with this then youre a life saver! So my settings is a HD 1080-60i(1920x1080, 29.970 FPS) template pixel format was 8-bit but I changed it up to 32 bit floating point (full range) and full-resolution rendering quality to best, then as you know, I  rendered as the Main concept HD internet 1080p

side note when I watch it on the camera screen it looks amazing! I understand its much smaller so everything will look amazing, but there is to much of a decline in quality for me to be content, do you think perhaps its a lens issue Im using the standard 18-55mm?
« Last Edit: February 08, 2013, 12:12:40 PM by DanceVideoTV »

Offline 1074

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Re: Lacking quality in Sony vegas
« Reply #3 on: February 08, 2013, 07:46:59 PM »
Make sure you've set the bit rate to an acceptable level in your render settings. Don't just use the default settings, they're way too low.

For Main Concept .MP4s I usually set it around 8,000,000 bps.
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Offline DanceVideoTV

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Re: Lacking quality in Sony vegas
« Reply #4 on: February 09, 2013, 10:59:40 AM »
Too low? The default is set at Max 24,000,000 and low as 12,000,000, my custom template I was using 14 and 14 for max and average

Offline AndyCivil

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Re: Lacking quality in Sony vegas
« Reply #5 on: February 09, 2013, 11:05:54 AM »
Pity, I was hoping that 1074 had identified the problem!

I'm going to do an HD experiment later today, and see if there seems to be any quality loss when using that codec. Can you put a name to the kind of quality loss that you're seeing? Is it an interlacing problem (combing) or a compression problem (blockiness)? Or something else?

Offline DanceVideoTV

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Re: Lacking quality in Sony vegas
« Reply #6 on: February 09, 2013, 11:10:00 AM »
Im not too well versed in the "proper" terminology, so If I had to best describe it, I would say Its not sharp, its sort of just flat. I found this video on youtube shot with my camera, now I didnt watch this for content just to get an idea of what quality I should be similarly resembling and its not even close,
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Offline Craig

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Re: Lacking quality in Sony vegas
« Reply #7 on: February 09, 2013, 04:45:18 PM »
Im not too well versed in the "proper" terminology, so If I had to best describe it, I would say Its not sharp, its sort of just flat. I found this video on youtube shot with my camera, now I didnt watch this for content just to get an idea of what quality I should be similarly resembling and its not even close

Why don't you post your own video so we can see where the problem may be.
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Offline DanceVideoTV

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Re: Lacking quality in Sony vegas
« Reply #8 on: February 09, 2013, 09:39:57 PM »
Well that would be the best solution however, Im unable to release said video as part of our production I can pre-release them to youtube or any video sharing type site, I could put up some screen shots if that helps?

Offline AndyCivil

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Re: Lacking quality in Sony vegas
« Reply #9 on: February 09, 2013, 10:45:48 PM »
It would probably help; as long as it demonstrates the problem! If the problem was jerkiness in the movement, of course a screenshot wouldn't help.

By the way, I think I'm lining up to give an answer of "that demo video you put up as a comparison, used video processing to increse the sharpness; for example, I paused at a random place, and what I happened to pause on, looked like the contrast was turned way up high, with seas of black". It may be no more than, the author used the right, wide aperture lens, and skilfully post-processed it to get the look he wanted.

Offline DanceVideoTV

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Re: Lacking quality in Sony vegas
« Reply #10 on: February 10, 2013, 12:07:01 PM »
It would probably help; as long as it demonstrates the problem! If the problem was jerkiness in the movement, of course a screenshot wouldn't help.

By the way, I think I'm lining up to give an answer of "that demo video you put up as a comparison, used video processing to increse the sharpness; for example, I paused at a random place, and what I happened to pause on, looked like the contrast was turned way up high, with seas of black". It may be no more than, the author used the right, wide aperture lens, and skilfully post-processed it to get the look he wanted.

Ahh, that makes a lot of sense, ok so I took 4 screens of the various places me shot, as you can see the edges are not sharp at all, perhaps its the lens, perhaps its the lighting as I used all natural light, but there was plenty of light on the last shot and there is no real difference, also I really want to thank you so much for the time you are taking to help me as well as teach me

Apologies on the tops of each photo

« Last Edit: February 10, 2013, 12:12:07 PM by DanceVideoTV »

Offline AndyCivil

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Re: Lacking quality in Sony vegas
« Reply #11 on: February 10, 2013, 01:45:53 PM »
Well, your screenshots don't look too bad, I guess that your issue is that the subject isn't too sharp? I think there are two things here: first, plain and simple, how 'in focus' is the lens? The camera only focuses once when you tell it to. It's almost as though you focused on the background, and then filmed while your subject performed. OK maybe not that bad, but it's hard to maintain focus especially when your subject is moving fast (and potentially changing distance from the camera) and the T2i doesn't have automatic features for refocusing during a shot.

In this respect, if you've upgraded from a camcorder, you might find this an issue and a disappointment because camcorders do this pretty well. I have an old Sony full-HD camcorder, one of the last to use tape, and I'm frequently impressed at just how good it was. Of course, moving to a DSLR does give you the option to choose your lens, aperture etc., that you could never do on a camcorder, but even so, the switch might be painful in this respect.

The other thing I see is motion blur. Motion blur doesn't have to be a problem, in fact it can look kinda jerky if you watch motion at 30fps and each frame is sharp; motion blur makes it more comfortable to watch. I don't know if you have enabled manual controls on movie shooting, but if not, you know that you can manually choose a shorter shutter speed, if the lighting and aperture can take it.

Sorry if either of these are too basic suggestions, I'm just giving the best advice I can from what I see.

Offline DanceVideoTV

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Re: Lacking quality in Sony vegas
« Reply #12 on: February 10, 2013, 07:53:59 PM »
Well, your screenshots don't look too bad, I guess that your issue is that the subject isn't too sharp? I think there are two things here: first, plain and simple, how 'in focus' is the lens? The camera only focuses once when you tell it to. It's almost as though you focused on the background, and then filmed while your subject performed. OK maybe not that bad, but it's hard to maintain focus especially when your subject is moving fast (and potentially changing distance from the camera) and the T2i doesn't have automatic features for refocusing during a shot.

In this respect, if you've upgraded from a camcorder, you might find this an issue and a disappointment because camcorders do this pretty well. I have an old Sony full-HD camcorder, one of the last to use tape, and I'm frequently impressed at just how good it was. Of course, moving to a DSLR does give you the option to choose your lens, aperture etc., that you could never do on a camcorder, but even so, the switch might be painful in this respect.

The other thing I see is motion blur. Motion blur doesn't have to be a problem, in fact it can look kinda jerky if you watch motion at 30fps and each frame is sharp; motion blur makes it more comfortable to watch. I don't know if you have enabled manual controls on movie shooting, but if not, you know that you can manually choose a shorter shutter speed, if the lighting and aperture can take it.

Sorry if either of these are too basic suggestions, I'm just giving the best advice I can from what I see.

I mean they arent awful I just feel as if I should be getting more quality out of it, but I will continue to try and work in different lights and areas to see if the problem reoccurs. It wasnt so much lacking sharpness in the subject but in the backgrounds like the trees in the first screen shot, their edges just seem flat and somewhat blurry, perhaps Im just knit picking a tad to much, but that's an interesting point about the focus I'll have to keep that in mind. You are correct with the motion blur for this type of work it adds a great deal, what lens would you recommend for filming?

Offline 1074

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Re: Lacking quality in Sony vegas
« Reply #13 on: February 11, 2013, 05:06:18 PM »
One thing that I've noticed with video & DSLRs is that while getting close-up and medium shots to look spectacular is pretty easy, wide shots can seem fuzzy or "lower quality."

I'm not entirely sure of all the factors involved, but DOF seems to be one of the leaders. I've had the best luck with wide (like 15mm) lenses set around f/8. My favorite wide when I had my T2i was the Sigma 15-30mm f/3.5-4.5 EX. Sadly it now lives on a shelf, since I can't mount it on my Nikon...













...It's for sale if you're interested.  8)
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Offline 1074

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Re: Lacking quality in Sony vegas
« Reply #14 on: February 11, 2013, 05:27:18 PM »
Just realized there's another possible factor...

In Vegas, go to File then click Properties.  Make sure you've got it set to the correct resolution, that full-resolution rendering is set to 'best,' and that deinterlace method is set to "none." 

A quick way to make sure you get the right settings is to open the Properties dialog then click on the folder icon in the top right. Navigate to the actual video files you're editing, and double click on one of them (or click and select "open." Either one works.). Vegas will set the project resolution accordingly. You'll still have to manually set the quality & deinterlace method, though.

(edit - would you look at that... post 2000! Wheeee!)
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